Category: Let's talk
hi.
i just saw the post in the anouncements board, and i just can't believe it. what ashame.
scott, you've been a cl for as long as i can remember and i don't think it will ever be the same with out all the joking around, the way you always had something to say to us and even the way you handled things as staff. i found it brilliant so thank you.
q, it's been a pleasure having you on the staff team. you've helped me a lot with problems i've had, and you, like scott did an awsome job with everything.
finally alicia, i think it's really cool you became cl. before that i barely knew you and you barely talked to anyone, but that changed with your staff position and again, really hope to see you around on the site as we've had some interesting talks.
lastly, to who ever becomes the new members of staff, good luck to you all and i hope you all do your jobs just as well as q, alicia and scott.
hope to see you around
time keeper
yes, it is a shame that all seemed to resign at once, but not a surprise none the less. Maybe there will be others who can replace the departing cls.
Call an election! Let's get as many members of the community involved as possible.
I'm sure there will be others who can replace them but it is a bit sad none the less.
If the problems Alicia, Scott, and Q mention are as bad as they say, and I believe that they are because I have been hearing past CL's say the same things for two years now, then perhaps it's new administrators we need, not just new CL's. I'm sure when Chris and JJ started this site they had a lot more time on their hands and loved being active site managers. However, for most of us, as we get older, our lives become more and more hectic and we have more and more responsibilities. So, if they no longer have time to manage the zone, then perhaps we need people who do have the time.
I don't need anything from here in terms of admins and CLs. Though things can be added or improved the website is good as it is.
Under a new admin, I wouldn't have resigned. Thanks Dan for starting this topic. If something could be done in any other way, I would have never had to do what I did today.
Thank you for your words, Becky. Chris has said himself that they never realize just what the Zone would become when they created it years ago. I'm glad you understand why we've done what we have. None of us are happy about it, believe me. I personally feel sad today.
I agree with Becky. I'm actually surprised that they haven't asked a third admin to help them out. This place may still be functional but it isn't moving forward - if anything it's moving backward since less people seem to log in now than a year ago - or maybe that's just my perception. I don't think it would be exactly difficult to find two or even three new people to help administer this place - there would be enough people with the time, the knowledge and willing to help out. Personally I don't see much being done about this though.
I agree with Senior to some extent. For the most part, I am happy with the zone the way it is. We have lots of options on here: we can pay for premium or come on for free, we can ignore people we don't like, we have many games to play that don't require us to download anything, we have message boards on a wide variety of topics and can say pretty much anything we want, and while we are playing games or reading the boards we can simultaneously chat via the quicknote system.
Having said all that, it is frustrating to see some good suggestions for changes get ignored, and I'm sure it is even more frustrating for the CL's because many zoners tend to expect them to make the changes, not realizing they need the admins to do these things.
This is so sad.
Scott, u were the best, u always made me laugh and we had nice conversations.
Q u were just so nice and u always got ings done.
Alicia i know i dont know u that well but u seemed like a good staff member.
I hope things work out for all of u.
Jess
I have to agree that I'm sorry to see you all go, but I've watched what seems like the Zone devolving over the last year or so. Huge thanks to all three of you for your efforts. Noone can replace you, as noone will bring the same style and aproaches that you each brought to your positions.
Lou
Peace to you 3. I've enjoyed you all, but I understand your reasons, and hope maybe change can and will come about, and if so maybe you will retake up your gift to this sight, for you work is and was a gift.
I agree with everything everyone else has said on this thread. The site really has kind of grinded to a halt over the past year or so. It would be nice to see the site managed by someone who has the time for it, by someone who can organize events and changes. I'm sorry to see you three go.
agree with everything said here. YOu all did a wonderful job.
I just wanna chime in with what Scott and Alicia said above. I too am sad for doing what I did, especially like this.
If things were different, I probably wouldn't even have resigned either.
it is sad to see zone become as what it is right now. all of you cls have had dedicate yourself to this site for basicly nothing but your own time anergy and interest without much return from the admins and appreciation from the members beside giving you all more dramas on top of whatever you all go thru as a person out of zone.
just want to offer my deepest appreciation to all of you, Scotty, AliCia and QQQ.
as Scott said on his resigned board, this will be a closing chapter for you guys, hope another chapter will rise from this, with more joy and excitement.
all of you cls, including the former cl members, me just want to say thank you for what you guys have done on this website.
it is a shame to see zone become like what it is now, but, i must say, it is not surprising, as it is pretty much predicted to happen, unless we have an active admin, who dedicate more of his time, or at least, give something back of what he earn from all the money from ppremium memberships that pay to him.
all the best for all the existing and former cls.
Well, there's always a time when people have to resign as CL's on here, and I completely understand the reasons why you 3 resigned. I was sort of shocked when I saw that board when I logged in here. lol But you 3 did a great job as community leaders. And perhaps we could have some new admins take over this sight if Jason and Chris can't handl and Chris can't handle this site anymore. I would love to see the suggestions that we've made on previous board topics be implemented into this site because it could make it better. And I agree with the previous posters on the fact that this place is going downhill, especially with less people logging in and more zone drama - which is actually quite amusing sometimes. lol But we all love you former CL's, and we hope that you will continue to log into this site. I'm confident that things will get better on here.
Well I didn't even know these three were community leaders to be quite honest but I'm sorry to hear of their resignation. But I can understand their reasons. There have actually been times where I've considered not logging back into the site simply because nothing really seemed to happen.
Hope al goes well for you 3. I've been thinking the same as all of you, we do need some new admins, I've never once, in all the time I've been here, seen chris or J log in. I've also seen slowly the number of users slowly going down as well, and do believe that the zone is dying a slow death. Their are sites that are like this place, but I've never found another site like this one so I always come back.
well I just think the three of you smell... lol
one issue that I see, do you have the option to change your accounts back? If not you'll be staying as CL's for a very long time...
This site does need a revamp of some kind but saying it's all the admins fault isn't all true, we as users can put back into what we want to take out of the Zone. like when dusty used to run quizes and such, there is nothing stopping us as users with support of cl's to do things at set times to make the zone enjoiable. I understand people have grown tired of the admins lack of input but really, Who needs the lazy JJ?
If we want the Zone to improve, to be more fun lets just do it!!!
post ideas and suggestions for events on the boards, the cl's can look to award points to users if they feel the idea is a good one, a quiz, a sining comp, a joke comp any number of things. the site and its features are here, lets use them.
as someone famous once said "time is our most precious resource. Wasted hours can never be reclaimed." Thank you three for being so generous with this most valuable and least appreciated gift. we can appreciate what you did and realize that it was undertaken after much thought and consideration. let's hope that those in authority wil realize that we don't want the zone to disappear. during my trauma and turmoil of the pasat few months it has been a spot of joy in my life. God bless all of you.
i agree with everyone else, and am sorry to see 3 good cl's resign. i also think that this place has not gone forward, and has just been left hanging. it's like a dog who doesn't want to play ball anymore...people are throwing the ball, but the dog has just lay down and doesn't feel like chasing it anymore...and thoes of us who own dogs kno what happens to them when they don't get exercise, they become fat, bord, and lazy. silly annalagy i kno, but you get the picture. this place doesn't hold it's appeal much anymore, and their is only so much you can do with points if your not a big game player.
oh and just to clarify, the members are the ones throwing the ball...or at least thoes of us who care and want to make this place better are.
Thanks again all of you for your words of support. To #2180, no, we don't have the ability to change our accounts back, but it was done for us as of this morning. The Zone site looks very different to me now. Believe me, it's a very strange feeling, and not a particularly pleasant one.
It is a bit of a shock seeing 3 of the staff going at once. It seems strange looking at the login list and seeing them listed as standard users and not CL's. While i've had some issues with the staff in the past, i'd like to make it clear that i'll draw a line under what happened and I won't hold anything against you 3.
As for the reason behind the decision, I don't obviously know what's been said on the staff list and stuff like that, but what I will say is that i've only ever seen one of the admins visibly logged in at the same time as me and that only happened once; that was Chris N. I have seen jj logged in visibly, but only by looking through qn history. While i'm not going to go on a fat rant about how crap the admins are, I think the admins need to either be a bit more active on the site or allow CL's to do some coding for the site.
And I know it's early days, but do we have any idea as to when the new CL's will be selected?
Remember, these are just my thoughts so please respect that.
Thank You
hi rob!.
the admins have done a great job on this website, though i agree with the amount of times they log in.
i've seen j only a couple of times since i've been a member, and that was for a very short time. i've seen chris more often though.
i think a few things really need to be done for the future, and while the admins do there best, a few issues need raising with them.
1. something needs to be done with alternate universe, or if not remove it and make something better in it's place.
2. i think there's been a breakdown in comunication on the site for a while now. the administrators need to take more notice of the suggestions board, and while they do respond to suggestions, they have not done for a while. cls do there best, send our feedback to the staff list, but it's the admin after all who decides if it gets coded or not. no admin, no features.
those are more of my thoughts
Scott you were one of the first people I met on the zone. You were a great CL and thank you for doing your job for so long. I enjoyed my time working with you on Tune Trivia. Which also throws Quinten into this. I didn't know you even really existed before then Quinten. I'll always cherish getting to know you and becoming your friend.
Alicia, if it weren't for you becoming a CL, I wouldn't have ever really talked to you. You were just one of many zoners who posted to the boards and I found a very intelligent read, but never got to know you. lol I still haven't all that well, but you were an awesome CL and you will be missed in your job.
Blah I suck at writing these things.
Y'all had better still be around.
I personally have no intention of leaving the site. Also, now that I've gotten used to having my publics onm, and being visible, I don't plan to go back to obscurity anymore. So, hopefully I'll get to know you better Pipi, as well as maintain the other friends I've made on here. And, thanks for your comments regarding my board posts. *Smile*
I guess I feel for the admins. I mean seriously, people have lives other than staying on the zone all the time. I mean JJ has other things that he manages like the blindbargain site and I think Chris does have a job and somehow, I thought JJ was in school too? I'm probably going to get flamed for what I have to say but frankly, I don't care. There are so many suggestions on how to improve the site everyday and one can't possibly keep up with them all. I mean how many times does Tom on myspace cater to all the millions of myspace users. We have probably over 9000 users on here with X active members who are always thinking about what should be different who don't always agree. I am sure the admins want to lead an active life and also want what is best for the zone so I am sure they don't appreciate being blamed for the "downfall" of this place either. All I am saying is I understand. Oh yeah. I want to add that I am not close at all to Chris or JJ. I think I've probably talked to them like once? Yes, I have been frustrated with them because they are slow in getting things done but honestly, a little understanding goes a long way. I don't blame the cls for leaving but honestly, pointing fingers doesn't help either you or the site. Yes. I think the zone is boring. But I don't think it's the CLS or the admins fault. I think it's the convos some users like to have in qns that play a big role in that. I honestly come on the zone to read the boards and post to them. And it's ok if the qn convos are boring. Some board topics are interesting and as long as we keep on thinking of the possitive, I think the zone will always remain somewhat cool. All I know is if I were JJ or Chris and even a CL, I'd get frustrated with all the bitching already and the zone would no longer be my pet project. So come on. Attack me if you must...
I forgot to say... Tyler for CL! And I'm not joking either! :) I'd vote for him, seriously!
While I agree that most of what the Zone has become has to do with the Here's what you don't get Michelle. J has not shown up to several staff meetings in a row, has only posted to the staff list once since Alternate Universe was brought back in September, etc. My point in telling you this info is that I understand that people have lives outsideof this website, a little effort now and again could never hurt. It's all a matter of priority really. I have graduate school, other sites I help out wiht, and all sorts of crap going on outside of here, but it doesn't mean I neglected my responsibilities on here. In fact, that's another reason I resigned. I have too much going outside of here to bother wiht it anymore. If only everyone could be genuine about it, we may have had more cl's who would be acctive and who would do something.
Good analogy Liz! Thank you all for your comments! They are truly apreciated. The zone will go on in some sort of capacity, just don't expect it to change much if things continue the way they have been.
And I'm officially a tool for not using the preview feature. Guess that is what happens when u r in a hurry. Oh well.
The thing that sort of disappoints me is the fact that JJ has only logged in 73 times this year, and has not really made any changes. Though I can understand that we all have lives and things like that, I'm sure that he could make some effort -- at least some effort -- to log in and keep up with some of our suggestions. And that makes me feel bad for the CL's because obviously they can't do anything about the coding of the site - and it would be cool if they could.
Yeah I agree Scott. You have stuck with this for the longest and yay for you for shrugging off the cl mask! Now go grab life by its boobs and suck away! Let others take the crap! :) I doubt that the zone will just die out cause there are still a number of people who stay logged in for hours but I do sort of feel for the admins as well hence the earlier post.
Lmao, Michelle, love your advice to Scott. The admin I feel bad for is Chris. He's the one who is trying to make an effort, in spite of his busy schedule, as Scott was saying. But he can't do it alone. We did all in our power to help him, but there was only so much we could do.
i sort of agree with michelle. but at the same time. even if he is busy. If you set up a meeting and say your going to attend you so should. I know for a fact this isn't something new. it was happening long ago when dan was a cl. Everyone else takes the time to make it. they all have stuff to do and they committed to being at the meeting then they should be there. Also, I can see how the cl's are frustrated at his lack of input. They take the complaints all day long and all they can do with it is take it to jay or chris. if jay don't show up at any meetings, he isn't hearing it. I also have seen many times when things were discussed on the staff list and he did show up to a meeting and new nothing of what was on the list. so obviously wasn't even reading it. I understand he has a life and is busy, and I think he has done a great job on this site, thanks to Chris for a lot of that too! But don't write checks your ass can't cash. Look at the points system. it has been promised for a long time now. years that every so often he was going to draw names and blah blah blah. That is still waiting to happen. and Dan hasn't been a cl for years now, and it was way bac when he was cl that that all happened. So my point is. if you going to charge people for the site, and promise the people that are paying for your site certain things, then you should probably carry through. if yu can't then don't even bring it up! If you are busy and can't handle what is being asked of you. at least attend a meeting and have the balls to say it's not happening because i'm really busy. I'm sorry and get over it! that would be much easier.
Now in saying all this. it's not only the admin that we don't see doing much. there are cl's that are doing the exact same thing. so it can't all be blamed on the admin. If these cl's aren't taking the job serious because of lack of input, then they to should step down and let someone else that is willing to deal with it all step up. logging in once a weak isn't enough for a cl. if you are busy then, this isn't the thing for you! my opinions anyway! Thanks to you three for dealing so long. lol
Thanks so much for your words, shea. I'd say Scott, quinten and I all did the best we were able as CL's, and yes, there certainly are some who remain who are not doing much more than J. *Grin*
I agree with Shea on the fact that a CL shouldn't just log in once a week. If I were a CL, I wouldn't have any problems logging in all the time because I log in all the time as it is. lol
Man, was I ever confused when I came to the login page and saw Alicia and Quinton on the standard user list. lol
While I'm very disappointed to see you three go, I can't say it was a shock, and your reasons are completely understandable. I had considered applying for a CL position before, but now I'm glad I didn't. I would've been furious at the lack of involvement from the admins and the insinuations from certain Zone members that the CL's are to blame. I know there were, and perhaps still are, some that don't get the fact that the CLs can only do so much on their own.
To the admins: I do not make any of these comments to attack you on a personal level. J, I don't know you, and Chris, during the few times we've talked, you seem to be a nice person and are apparently making some effort with the site at least. But I'm not impressed with the administrative involvement on the whole. I certainly understand having a busy life, but the fact remains that anyone who has adminastrative power over something has a responsibility to be involved in its maintenance and growth. The apathy shown on the whole by the people at the top of the chain of command on here is unprofessional. For me, the Zone is many things: a place to hang out, make new friends, and play games, but also to network and exchange useful information. Furthermore, premium members have even more to be angry about when they are not getting what was promised to them. I wouldn't for a moment consider renewing my premium membership right now.
Again, I sympathize with the CL's who have resigned (both recently and further back) because of the lack of help from the admins. I have come to know what it's like to have neither the authority nor the means to implement changes from my position in the chain of command and to worry about whether the people at the top will do anything. Admins, I'm sorry, but you've no one to blame but yourselves for whatever happens to this site if you don't take a more active role or give the power to someone who will.
Becky
A responsibility? They're admins of a website, not politicians, social workers, police officers, etc. They only have as much responsibility as they choose to have.
I haven't noticed the features getting worse. It's just as good as it was in terms of usability.
I agree, but at the same time, if you're going to encourage us to suggest ways to make the site better, then read them. If you can't, then don't give us that option. If you're not going to log in any more than once a month or less, don't tell the CL's to do more. Like someone mentioned earlier, if you're too busy to keep up the job, step down. People will be more understanding if you step down and admit you can't do it for various reasons then just not to show up. There have been a few people that have gone so far as to suggest that the admins don't care about the site, and although I think it is wrong to make such an accusation, there is evidence to suggest something along those lines. If you care about the site, own up to it and give someone else the responsibility of handling it. I mean, sure, nothing can always be as it was, but it can still be great. If there's a suggestion a user has made that you honestly can't fulfill as an admin, get on the board and post that you can't. If said user can't accept that, then that's his or her problem, but at least you would have told us that it is not possible.
On the other hand, I don't think the admins should be totally at fault here, nor should the CL's. There are some users who come on here to start drama, verbally abuse other users, and basically abuse the right to express themselves freely. Yes, that is wrong, but it puts significant pressure on the staff of this site to constantly be breaking up fights, judging and removing, if necessary, inappropriate board posts. They will never make everybody happy, but some people seem to think they can.
I think the cause of this site's "slow death" as we say, is the fault of both the standard users and the admins. The CL's are the middle man who are constantly trying to keep up with the activity on here while also trying to get the admins to do their part. Congratulations for making it this far, and thank you very much to you three for being responsible. It takes courage to do what you have done, and you should be applauded for it. To the remaining CL's, good luck.
To Michelle and others who think we are placing all the blame on the admins, I have said this in quicknotes and will say it again here, there should be either more admins, or JJ and Chris should leave and get on with their lives and two new admins, who do not have extremely busy lives should be appointed who can be more of a presence on the zone. That's not to say the admins and CL's should implement every single suggestion on the suggestions board. Good greif, I have red some extremely stupid suggestions there. So to those of you who are whining about the admins simply because none of your particular suggestions have been implemented, maybe it's not that they didn't read them but that they couldn't stop laughing long enough to respond.
I still think there are more positive things about the zone than negative things and still enjoy coming here. But, we have just lost the three best and most caring CL's and are not left with much. And the admins need to either get reinvolved with the site or find replacements who can do this.
Until yesterday, I'd never read anybody saying on here that it was dying a slow death. 3 CLs say it, then some of the users say it, but don't go on to use the features available to them to bring the site off the life support machine I presume they think it is on.
It is up to the owner how much attention he pays to the website, and what features he implements.
Suggestions are a form of advice. Advice and suggestions don't have to be taken on board.
As a relatively new member, I would take a slightly different take on all this. I have no way of knowing how the Zone is decaying / degenerating: many of you here have written quite informative, entertaining, and witty articles on the Boards - the area I've looked at the most. Whether that was a couple years ago or recently, to a new member, that's months of on-again off-again reading. While I don't know exactly what CLs do, it seems they are in middle management, as it were, and I'm sorry they felt the crunch from users. The only one I knew was a CL was SisterDawn - Alicia? I have seen your posts and you write well. It is certainly sad that three of you felt you must resign at once, but that being the case would show there's something serious going on. We as users can't possibly know what its like to be in your position, but it's my hope at least, that users might be more sensitive to the CLs in the future. as to the drama, well that's up to the users, and considering the age of some of the participants, not particularly surprising. Albeit sometimes the outcome can be rather witty in its own way; the recent virtual gangs did rather a bang-up job of portraying "Lord of the Flies" on the message boards, but there again that's no reflection on a CL or the site itself. I shall have to check out the Alternate Universe. Anyway, all the best to you three who have left, and don't forget that your resignations may help the rest of us users appreciate your contributions a bit more.
Senior, only one comment, and maybe a solution...It is up to the owner to decide how much he/she wishes to put into a site yes, but it is up to the user to ensure he's getting his/her money's worth. And obviously there are some premium users who don't feel they are. You know, I wasn't on The Zone for over a year, and when I came back only one new thing had been added; at least for standard users. That's ok. I do what I want and move on to the next site that I want to particepate on, but it doesn't appear from what I've seen/heard that much has changed for the premium users either, and obviously those who are paying someone money have the right to complain when nothing/very little has been happening. But, here is my solution. Let the admins decide how much they want to do, but those who are unhappy quit paying. Then, only a few options are left, either admins will particepate more or the zone will die. *shrug* Wouldn't matter to me. I don't pay because of this very issue, and yes, at one time I was a paying member. :) Anyways, my 2 cents... LOL, not that I expect anyone to agree, but remember, I'm not complaining, (really) I don't feel I have the right since I don't pay, but that's just it, I won't pay, and it's up to paying members to force a change of some form. :)
I don't think premium users were promised loads of new features before they agreed to pay, so they haven't been ripped off.
At least the zone is still waaaaay better than blinknation! *laughs I'm sorry but that site is "dead!"
Very true, Michelle. *Grin* thanks for reminding us of what we do still have. LOL.
LibraLady, Inu-Princess, and Ocean Dream, thank you guys for your kind words. It helps to know there are people on this site who understand why we've done what we have.
It's really sad to see three of the best CL's resigning, but I completely understand why it was done. I agree with what Becky has posted, and I don't think I could say it any better than she did.
and LOL at Michelle's last post. Agreed there too.
i didn't know the zone was dying. of course I only look at the boards and play the games. I'm not going to ever talk on the quick notes. too shy to do that. I will do what ever I can to keep this site viable and vibrant. It is unique and wonderful.
I, too, am sorry to see Scott, Alicia and Q go. While I admit that I don't post much on the boards, I do make a presence in quicknotes and try to help people with whatever questions they might have. Sometimes being a CL really is frustrating, especially when people want things that we, as CLs, don't have access to do anything about. I will continue to do all I can to help users with questions or feature suggestions or whatever.
Take care, and thanks again to you three for all of your hard work. It was fun working with and getting to know you. Please do stay around and keep in touch.
Hello all!
First I want to say I think it really sucks that three people choose to leave at the same time. If this was a business, I think someone would want to look at what is wrong and fix it!
Now What will happen? We are loosing a tun of experience, patients and really good people that cared about us users that use the sight!
I hope that if the person that started the sight doesn't care about it anymore, give it over to someone who will care. This place has been fun, enjoyable, and very helpful. I don't know Q as well as Scott and Alicia, but I know you all did a wonderful job, and yes, your all going to be missed!!
Brian
Damn. I really need to log in more often, look at all the shit I seem to miss.
To the resigned CL's. Um, I barely knew any of you, but I regret that things have deteriorated to such a degree that your actions were necessary. Oh wait, Scott, I did talk to you, like once. Good times.
I didn't go through every post so I really hope this isn't redundant. It isn't just me who thinks not as many people seem to log in lately? Last year I'd get on at any time of the day or night and the QN's would be fast and furious. Now I could log on at noon or midnight and there's maybe 1 or 2 conversations going on. Whatever needs to be improved in terms of the site itself, the low attendance is the most discouraging part for me. Hope we get outa this rut soon.
And to think I once entertained thoughts of being a CL, now don't get any ideas! lol
ok, i'll put my two pence worth in. i suggested, yeards before they were implemented, that terms and conditions of use were set up to police this place. they only came to pass years later when laws outside this place came about. i was shunned by the admins for my suggestions, as being, against free speach. which seemed to be held up as a god above all else. all i was talking of were things like we've got now. but this was dismissed as "against the american way."
so i unerstand why the cls left.
I've been on this website for a very long time and I can also say that the site is definitely going downhill, and has been for awhile.
Scott and Q, you guys were both amazing people, and the things you did for the site were amazing. As people previously mentioned, you will be severely missed. Scott's jokes, Q's well written posts all these little quirks that made you guys who you were, thanks for dedicating your time to this site.
Alicia, while I don't really know you it will be sad to see you go as well. I do hope to see you around more though as well and get to know you, and you will also be missed.
as for the admins, chris has gone out of his way for the zone and I mean seriously gone out of his way to try and at least keep the site running smoothly. Even with his busy schedule and his job and what not he still finds some time to log in and do what he can. As for J, I wish I could say the same about him but I won't say much that hasn't already been said. I will say though that is's just as much the users fault as it is the admins as well, the community leaders have to keep the users in line while at the same time anything that arises that they can't handle they have to give to the admins who aren't always around. I agree perhaps it's time for some new admins, but these people really honestly have to be able to manage a site that has the potential to have lots of people on it, and not only that, but these people would have to bring the site out of it's slump, so that's a project that won't be an easy one to consider.
Once again to the cl's that are leaving, thanks for your time and efforts.
Jessica
last night i couldn't sleep and was thinking about this a lot. you know we may be putting some blame where it does not need to reside. today, there are many more options for people to use. we have the face book and the my space and the twitter stuff. some may be the seeming indifference of the admins, but it may also be like cable. back in the day if we were lucky, we had three or in some markets four tv networks. Now with cable and aatelite and internet there are a gazillion options. so it is with this site... just a thought...
then is incombant upon the admins to make this site worth something in the cut and thrust of online stuff maybe? just my thoughts.
Agreed, Smoky. It boils down to how much the admins want to keep the site running. There really isn't another site quite like this one, and as I said before, the admins have only themselves to blame for what happens to it.
The matter of the bullying that is so prevalent on the Zone is one that I considered bringing up yesterday, but it's a bit of a digression from the topic at hand. However here goes: I believe in freedom of speech, but I also know that there can be consequences for certain statements. The things often said to underage users and the way users with cognative disabilities are berated on this site are unbelievable and should not be tolerated. Furthermore, if I were currently considering registration on the Zone and could see some of the conversations in public QN's, I'd probably dismiss the site without a second thought. At any rate, I'd advise everyone to start collecting contact info from the people with whom you'd like to stay in touch, just in case.
Becky
becky i totally agree re the bullying and generation x and degeneration x etc. etc. people need to treat others as they want to be treated.
While I do agree on the fact that people should treat others how they want to be treated, I have to remind people sometimes that there is an ignore feature there, so if you don't like what some people tell you, just put them on ignore. I've had to do that a few times to some people because of some crazy things that happened, and I still have those few people on ignore. But yeah, I do agree that people should treat others with respect and not be so they should also respect themselves.
Ok, I had some typos, so I'll do that last sentence over again. I agree that people on here should treat others with respect, and that they should also respect themselves.
Michael, believe me, I utilize the "ignore" feature quite often, but it's not a suitable solution for the bullying. Even if you have someone on "ignore", you still have to hear everything else being said about whatever bullying is going on at a given time, not to mention the fact that conversations can be hard to follow when you have half the people talking in publics on "ignore".
Becky
I don't believe I said that they were promised loads of new features, but just if they're unsatisfied than don't pay it again. I'm not attempting to lay blame anywhere. All I'm saying is that there doesn't appear to be much improvement from what I've seen, and premium members have an option if they wish to excercise it; it's called not paying for it if your not happy with it.
Inu-Princess, they'll never stop bullying on this site. They don't want to.
Though you and I think it is unacceptable and unnecessary, and even if you share my belief that it is one area where the community leaders do have power if they wish to use it, there are current and former community leaders, and plenty of users who are happy to let the bullying and abuse on here go on.
They don't consider or care about the effect of the abuse on those who are targeted. In some cases they get on with and side with some of the abusers.
They would probably argue, that restricting the freedom of people to say what they want would speed up the site's apparent death, as people would not get as much enjoyment from the site.
Like me, you may know of people who don't use the site actively because they don't like seeing all the bullying and obscenety on here. Their views don't seem to matter asmuch as those of people who are responsible for such behaviour.
We're getting way off topic here. But the fact is, bullying and profanity are part of life. You can't point an "ignore" gun at people in real life who bother you, so in a way, you are luckier on here than in real life in terms of how to deal with bulliers. And CL's certainly can't ban every zoner who has ever insulted you. We'd have no one left. So grow up and deal with it, Senior.
Not necessarily. In real life, if you're bullied in a company with decent managers, they will put an end to the bullying. If in my organisation, volunteers or members were bullying others, there would be consequences. An ignore button wouldn't be necessary.
Your post accurately illustrates the point I made in the post before it.
You state the CL's have the power to prevent the abuse, this is only partially true.
As much of the abuse doesn't violate a turm they have no power to regulate it. Keep in mind, This is not a corperation with turms of conduct and all that. Its a websight. Cl's don't have the power to work out side of the turms even if they don't believe something is just so trying to pin the blaim on them in this case really doesn't work though I agree the bullying gets over the top.
Seccondly, While the admins never stated a hole swarm of new features would be constantly comeing at premiums, the premium page states that they are open to new feature requests and would take them in to account. I understand They have livesbut it all comes back to follow threw. If this were an actual corperation of high standing and the admins wern't comitted because of other obligations people would have taken more action to force change.
As it stands the admins or at least cris n is makeing an effort but they can't handle the sight, the mature thing to doo would be to find another admin or 2 to help out.
I feel sorry for the CL's having to make this choice but I understand why. On the bright side, We get to see them as users and they don't have the pressure of being a cl so they might show us a side they didn't and even so, seeing scott as A non cl has been interesting. Best of luck to our former and current staff.
Another thing senior, for the past year many users have been saying the zone is declineing and the bullies are takeing over. users have been leaving the sight or not becoming as active because of those 2 reasons. One of my best friends on this sight hasn't signed in in about a year because of it. Mabie you should doo a better job of keeping up with the sight and people before you blow that burnt shit you call thoughts on to this bord because while you want people to be current and take everything in to account before they act, you don't give the perception of doing so. I could be wrong but still. Get off your high horse and really think back man.
I still like the sight but its sad to see it start a decline. I hope its fortune looks up.
Hey
Well I am so sorry to see you three CL's go though I do not know any of you very well. Good luck to your future plans and yes we definitely need some new site admins. I love this site for the boards and games but just feel like everyone else it needs some new blood.
to be honest I think that websites have a shelf-life, and that ultimately something else takes over and they move on.
I think it's worth remembering that when the zone was first created, it was at a time when many of the other community type sites were largely inaccessible. So the zone was created in order to give people with a visual impairment the chance to use such websites but without the graphics and pretty colours and pictures and all the other gimics that make other sites attractive to those with site, but inaccessible to those without.
But now we have facebook and twitter, and the access technology has moved on as well, thus meaning that people are able to participate on the mainstream sites and don't necessarily feel the need to come back to sites designed specifically for blind users.
And in reality, the zone cannot offer anything that facebook doesn't. But the difference with the zone is that because it's only a relatively small site, people have to pay for the features in order to keep them running, whereas with the likes of facebook the features are free.
Ultimately, no admin of a small website can compete with that.
I also think that sites are cyclical, and a site that is driven by its members will not remain the same, by virtue of the fact that the members will move on to different sites/to rl etc.
I think the issue of the differences between the CL's and the admins and the issue of the site's apparent decline are two separate things.
I think that if you as a site administrator are going to take on staff but only give them limited power then you do have a responsibility to ensure that you as an admin have an input into what goes on if the staff you employ have not been given such powers. Therefore the issue the departed cl's have with the admins' input (or lack thereof) is perfectly valid.
But wrt the apparent decline of the site, there are surely a number of factors responsible for people's perception of that, some of which must surely be attributed to the members and their conduct.
I am with michelle in the sense that I don't care much about the site. I log in here maybe two or three times a month, have a quick chat, occasionally post on a board topic. But I used to be a much more prevalent member than that. And while my having other things that take up my time in RL had a part to play in my declining presence here, there were also other things that have come from within the site that have led to my not spending as much time here.
When I was a member here several years ago it was possible to have inteligent discussion in quicknotes, I was a prolific board poster and had some interesting discussions and yes, some fallings out (goblin anyone?). But now if you log into the zone the discussion in quicknotes is anything but inteligent, and the majority of board posts are taken up with virtual games and virtual gang warfare, Not to mention the open bullying of users that goes on both within quicknotes and on the boards.
And people say "well you don't have to read it, use the ignore feature," but I don't want to use the ignore feature. I want to come on to a website and have an interesting discussion without having to ignore 99% of the users that are incapable of inteligent discussion. so because I can't do that here I choose to go to websites where I can.
But equally there are people who want to come here to have non inteligent discussion and so this site is perfect for them. But the ones who don't want that have left and moved elsewhere.
With regard to bullying on the site that is IMO a different issue and should not be tolerated under any circumstances. The ignore feature is a cop-out that allows users to be ridiculed and it comes down to the user to block it rather than the perpitrators being stopped. If I were someone looking to make friends here I would certainly think twice after seeing some of the board posts (which it should be remembered are publically viewable before someone actually signs up here).
Oh Clare you said it all! :) I don't think it's the fact that the zone is dead or will be blah blah blah, it's just there are so many other sites out there now that are way more accessible than it was in 2003 when the zone was first created. I mean this has been a 6-7-year project! I think it's wonderful it was around that long and I still believe that if people wouldn't bitch so much, the zone will still stay around for a good while after. I was a premium member for 2 years back when I was an active member but now I am not because I don't log on here as much. And it's not because I don't like the zone or whatever. I just find the qn convos on here tedious. And for those of you who don't find the qn convos boring, more power to you! That is perfectly ok. I think it is really funny. As time goes by, you can observe how much people change. Those of you who were active members in 03-05 probably thought those of us who were active in 05-07 weird/boring/whatever and so on... It's a cycle that goes on which I find very interesting. I think that if we get past this and the current active members "become jaded with the zone," they will find that the new zone generation is lacking in some way like how we think of them. I too am sorry the cls did what they did but honestly, the zone has to evolve and like anything, a lot of people won't be able to appreciate the new. You always here: "Things were so much better in my day..." All I know is, when the zone is down, I still here people freaking out like they did when I was an active member so I don't think people hate the zone as much as they claim to. I mean our group used to sit on vt when the zone was down and so many people came on to ask why the site was down. And now, people go on zbp and ask about the site or the other way around. Someone said something about how premium members have a choice to pay or not if they don't like the service and I totally agree with them. I mean most of the site is free anyway. I don't play anagrams as much as I used to or make long audio profiles so I don't find it necessary to pay for the site when I already have a free game and 20 seconds for people to hear my lovely voice if they choose to. :d If they started charging to read and reply to board posts however, I will make a huge fuss about that. Oh yeah. And BTW, what ever happened to Goblin? I miss that Scottish bugger! :p Yes. I will always miss the old zone but life is always moving forward and no matter how much you complain about it, the show must go on!
I know of at least two people who don't use this site that often because of the bullying that goes on here.
There is a term that says:
have to say that I wouldn't recommend the zone to an outsider either. Because I wouldn't want them to come here and to associate me with some of the stuff that goes on here.
Now I realize that this is a long way off of the original topic however I just wish to make a point about the ignore feature. You know it's funny to me as somebody who has been here a long time to see how the perception of it has changed to the point that now it is used to beat the admins over the head with. The ignore feature, at no point was a feature designed as an easy cop out, far from it in fact, it was introduced by the admins at the request of users who at that time, for whatever reason, couldn't get along with other users. Indeed if you care to trawl back far enough through the boards you can find whole debates on the ignore feature and whether it should or shouldn't have been implemented. But the point is that it was, and done so at the request of people who wanted it. The admin's didn't rock up one day and say hey, instead of dealing with bullying on the site we've come up with this opt out scheme.
It's just a small point I know but I do get irritated when people make unfounded accusations as though they're points of fact, when they're nothing of the sort.
Dan.
agree Dan, people who think they bbeen bully by others should just move on and get out of the day. as i said before, and i will perhaps said it again, zone is no different from a community that one live in. if one got bully on the street, because one and another person point of view crashes, what one will do. either live with it, or leave the community and go to other place, that will have the same situation.
zone used to be a lovely side, when it was manageable around 5000 users, everything is fine, where you can find peace and harmony here. now, when it approaching 10000 users, things are much different. CLS can only do their bits, the remaining pretty much depends on between users itself.
i agree with Clair, this isn't a website that i would have introduce to an outsider, unless he or she is a truely drama queen and king. lol
I certainly don't think the admins see the ignore feature as a cop-out, in fact I was a part of the initial debates and have always been opposed to the ignore feature, especially on the boards.
But I do think that many users see it as a cop out.
Over time I have read lots of posts, and have in fact contributed to discussions about A the way some people are treated by others, B, some of the content that younger users are exposed to, and the justification is always given as "there is an ignore feature, people are free to use it." which somehow seems to give out the message that it is the responsibility of those being bullied/taking offence to ignore rather than the responsibility of the bullies to modify their behavior.
Season your street analygy is wrong. If somebody was regularly being bullied by people in their street, action would be taken against the bullies by the local council or if necessary the police. People shouldn't be pushed out of anything by bullies. The bullies should be pushed out.
Back to the orrigional purpose of the board.
I'm sad to see all 3 of you go. You all did a great job with what you had and i know that several people including myself appreciated the exilant job. Best of luck and hugs to all 3 of you. :)
this boards intent was to say thank you to the CL's that are leaving their posts. but as per zone norm it's a rant about how much we all hate this and that but just can't stay away despite it.
Thank you Scott, Q and Aliscer. and bolocks to the rants.
Hisenthusiasticlova, I have to partially disagree with you about what you said about board posts. Some users have, in fact, started a few inteligent board posts, but the posts filled with drama always seem to find their way to the top. I agree with you that their are fewer of the inteligent board posts started, however.
I'm sorry. You must have me mixed up with someone else. I don't think I complained in this thread about how boring the boards are. I think they are the best part of the zone... Correct me if I am wrong though.
Hi,
I signed up to the zone in 2004, so I have to agree that the discussions in qn's were much more intelligent, much more pleasant. I thought the people really wanted to be here and went out of their way to be friendly. The admins were involved and the site was evolving all the time. I guess that's because it was still relatively new, and was a growing community. I agree with what others have said about how this site lost its appeal for some because other social networking sites became accessible.
As time went on I slowly went from turning off publics, to now having none on at all, as it seems for some reason i get asked creepy questions by people who try to pick me up. I enjoy coming on here to read the boards, but that's about it, as I think the points system is backwards, but that's a whole other topic, and I didn't come on this board to bitch, I just wanted to say that I was once an active member of this site and did think very highly of it.
Now I don't know Alicia or Q very well, but Scott, I think I remember talking to you several times back when I was first a member. Like everyone else on this board, I'm sad to see you all go, and I hope that's a wake up call to the admins to make some changes to how they run the site these days.
On a final note, I think everyone makes of this site what they want to, and what works for one person might piss the next person off, but it's all about what you want to take from it. I look back and remember the zone when it was in its prime, and that's enough for me. Others will have their own good and bad memories of the site, and that's ok too. I agree also with the poster who said that websites usually run a course, but I do hope the zone's time isn't up quite yet. I think there's still hope to bring some life back into it.
I'm sorry, that wasn't you who said that. Lol. My appologies.